http://blog.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages hourly 1 1901-01-01T00:00+00:00 http://gmane.org/img/gmane-25t.png http://gmane.org http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9889 <pre>Hi folks, I manage various in-house taxonomies and would appreciate your advice. For each “object” we have our own numeric PermID plus (optionally) one or more Identifiers of Identifier Types suited to the Object Type. For languages, we have an Identifier Type “BCP47”. In the case of Simplified Chinese, the corresponding Identifier contains the value “zh-Hans”. We’ve been approached by a group which wants us to associate the value “zh-CN” with Simplified Chinese. We’ve refused to do this using the Identifier Type “BCP47” but have offered to create another Identifier Type to hold this value and similar values which may, from time to time, be needed. I don’t know what to call this Identifier Type. I’ve considered both “ISO639-1” and “RFC1766”. Your advice would be appreciated. Thanks, Misha ________________________________ This e-mail is for the sole use of the intended recipient and contains information that may be privileged and/or confidential. If you are no</pre> Misha.Wolf< at >thomsonreuters.com 2013-06-13T13:55:45 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9885 <pre>Hi. ISO639-3 iso639-3 at sil.org Fri May 24 21:42:05 CEST 2013 Thanks. I found the list of 2012 change requests acted on; it is at: http://www-01.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/639-3_ChangeRequests_2012_Sum&amp;Add.pdf To locate change requests for retired code elements, use the following format: (without the language code) http://www-01.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2012-069.pdf To locate change requests for new code elements, use the following format (with the language identifier/code): http://www-01.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2012-001_wth.pdf (I have not looked through these much yet. }: ) Best, --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar&lt; at &gt;hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> CE Whitehead 2013-05-31T19:19:43 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9884 <pre> Dear Ietf Community, Several of the outstanding requests for the 2012 change cycle have been resolved. Please visit the ISO639-3 website for the Addendum to the 2012 Summary report listing the accepted or rejected changes. If you use the download tables, the new revised tables are also available. Thank you for your interest in the ISO 639-3 standard. Melinda Lyons ISO 639-3 RA SIL International 7500 W. Camp Wisdom Rd. Dallas, TX 75236 </pre> ISO639-3 2013-05-24T19:42:05 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9877 <pre>Hi. Doug Ewell doug at ewellic.org Wed Mar 20 15:32:29 CET 2013&gt; I agree with Mark that trying to apply language tags to personal names Yes, and if "Bob" is not French, "Robert" can be, and many people also do take names that seem to belong to other languages/ethnicityies -- thus you have "Bob l'eponge". (Is "Catherine" French while "Kate" German? In any case, reading this thread cheered me up for some reason, and also did wonders for the lyme disease in my legs and feet, so cheers!) Best, --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar&lt; at &gt;hotmail.com &gt; -- &gt; Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> CE Whitehead 2013-03-20T21:41:54 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9858 <pre>Hi. John Cowan cowan at mercury.ccil.org Fri Mar 15 18:26:30 CET 2013 That's an o.k. change for me; I don't see any reason not to do it (although I've not been paying enough attention these days to this list's threads). Best, --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar&lt; at &gt;hotmail.com _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> CE Whitehead 2013-03-16T15:25:28 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9842 <pre> This is the answer that Benson needed. This is NOT the answer that Benson needed. This group isn't empowered to avoid the additional complexity of macrolanguages. BCP 47 has a mechanism in place to deal with them. The mechanism was an uneasy compromise and it does add complexity to the tagging model, but when 639-3/RA decides to assign a macrolanguage, that's pretty much that; the mechanism kicks in. To say that the group tries to avoid the complexity of macrolanguages implies that we can somehow override the RA's decision. I don't think we want to perpetuate that belief among users. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA http://ewellic.org | &lt; at &gt;DougEwell ­ _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> Doug Ewell 2013-03-08T16:48:40 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9840 <pre>Hi, Why doesn't Swabian have German as a macrolanguage? See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swabian_German %% Type: language Subtag: swg Description: Swabian Added: 2009-07-29 _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> Benson Limketkai 2013-03-07T23:46:30 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9836 <pre> Dear Ietf Community, Christian Galinsky has agreed to resume his previous role as chair of the Joint Advisory Committee overseeing ISO 639. He is the Registrar for ISO 639-1 at Infoterm. Please welcome him back to this role. Sincerely, Melinda Lyons Secretary Joint Advisory Committee ISO 639 </pre> ISO639-3 2013-02-13T22:41:08 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9835 <pre>LANGUAGE SUBTAG MODIFICATION File-Date: 2013-xx-xx %% Type: region Subtag: PS Description: State of Palestine Added: 2005-10-16 %% --- LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM 1. Name of requester: Doug Ewell 2. E-mail address of requester: doug at ewellic.org 3. Record Requested: Type: region Subtag: PS Description: State of Palestine 4. Intended meaning of the subtag: 5. Reference to published description of the language (book or article): 6. Any other relevant information: This registration tracks a change made to ISO 3166-1 effective 2013-02-06, changing the English short name from "Palestinian Territory, Occupied" to "Palestine, State of". For more information, refer to ISO 3166-1 Newsletter VI-14, "Name change for State of Palestine and other minor corrections", at http://www.iso.org/iso/iso_3166-1_newsletter_vi-14_name_change_state_of_palestine.pdf . -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA http://ewellic.org | &lt; at &gt;DougEwell ­ _______________________________________________ Ie</pre> Doug Ewell 2013-02-13T04:12:43 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9833 <pre>I have consulted with the ISO 639-2 registrar, and we have agreed on a way to handle the Greek requests. Our consultation happened after the closure of requests for 2012, so will be handled in the 2013 cycle. Vedic Sanskrit will also be handled in this way. Melinda Lyons ISO 639-3 RA SIL International 7500 W. Camp Wisdom Rd. Dallas, TX 75236 Message: 2 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 16:02:22 -0500 From: John Cowan &lt;cowan&lt; at &gt;mercury.ccil.org&gt; To: ISO639-3 &lt;iso639-3&lt; at &gt;sil.org&gt; Cc: ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no Subject: Re: ISO 639-3 changes posted Message-ID: &lt;20130124210222.GD14317&lt; at &gt;mercury.ccil.org&gt; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii ISO639-3 scripsit: &gt; (www.sil.org/iso639-3/). There is also a summary of changes for those &gt; who need it. Thanks. Are the three outstanding Greek requests (2006-084, 2009-060, 2009-081) ever going to be processed? They seem to remain perpetually in the "Current" section. -- One Word to write them all, John Cowan &lt;cowan&lt; at &gt;ccil.org&gt; One Access to fin</pre> ISO639-3 2013-01-25T20:08:36 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9832 <pre>ISO 639-3/RA has announced their annual batch of changes, and posted new data files: http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/default.asp http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/download.asp The announcement says 136 change requests were approved, which probably means there will be roughly (but not necessarily exactly) 136 changes to the Language Subtag Registry. I will be going through these in the coming weeks and preparing the necessary forms. If anyone wants to look at the new 639-3 files and has a question about how the Registry will handle this or that change, please feel free to ask. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA http://ewellic.org | &lt; at &gt;DougEwell ­ _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> Doug Ewell 2013-01-24T21:56:56 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9830 <pre> Dear ietf community, I have just posted the new tables to the ISO 639-3 webpage (www.sil.org/iso639-3/). There is also a summary of changes for those who need it. All the living languages posted in this round of 2012 changes will have supporting reference information in the 17th edition of the Ethnologue which is to be published soon. Melinda Lyons ISO 639-3 RA SIL International 7500 W. Camp Wisdom Rd. Dallas, TX 75236 </pre> ISO639-3 2013-01-24T20:16:06 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9828 <pre> Dear ietf list members, In reviewing the 2012 changes, the review committee suggested that instead of changing the name of code [ppr] Piru to Luhu, that last year's mistake of deprecating [lcq] Luhu and retaining and merging the two into [ppr] should be changed. Therefore, the ISO 639-3 RA is planning to re-activate code [lcq] Luhu and deprecate [ppr] Piru when the new changes are posted next week. The forms requesting the earlier change were written in such a way that the medium-sized language group was merged into a very small dying one, which was not intended by the requester. This problem was only discovered after the 2011 changes were posted. I have checked with Doug Ewell and he feels BCP 47 should not have a problem with this. Melinda Lyons ISO 639 RA SIL International 7500 W. Camp Wisdom Rd. Dallas, TX 75236 </pre> ISO639-3 2013-01-17T20:19:43 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9827 <pre>I've been informed that ISO 639-3 will be rolling out this code element along with the rest of their annual change set, which might be as early as the end of January. Since it's already been added to 639-2, here are the proposed record and registration form, for the usual two-week review period. ===== LANGUAGE SUBTAG MODIFICATION File-Date: 2013-xx-xx %% Type: language Subtag: zgh Description: Standard Moroccan Tamazight Added: 2013-xx-xx %% ===== LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM 1. Name of requester: Doug Ewell 2. E-mail address of requester: doug at ewellic.org 3. Record Requested: Type: language Subtag: zgh Description: Standard Moroccan Tamazight 4. Intended meaning of the subtag: 5. Reference to published description of the language (book or article): 6. Any other relevant information: This registration tracks a change made to ISO 639-2 effective 2012-11-21, adding the code element 'zgh' for Standard Moroccan Tamazight. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, CO, USA http://ewellic.org</pre> Doug Ewell 2013-01-10T22:44:47 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9825 <pre>Hello, The new [zgh] language code is now listed in the official ISO 639-2 table. http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/code_list.php zgh Standard Moroccan Tamazight amazighe standard marocain and http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-2/php/code_changes.php Regards, Patrick Andries _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> Patrick Andries ⚖ sǝıɹpuɐ ʞɔıɹʇɐd 2013-01-10T16:08:47 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9819 <pre> Oops, I spent 3 weeks without checking this list I guess because this discussion is 3 weeks past. If it's not too late, here are my "two cents." Doug Ewell doug at ewellic.org Thu Dec 13 18:56:47 CET 2012 www.livingtongues.org/hotspots/hotspot.SSA.SouthernCone.TsesungunHuillichesungun.html lists: Tsesungun Huillichesungun and Mapudungan "dialects;" and says also that, "Despite being further away from the center of the Mapudungun language area than Tsesungun, Huillichesungun is closer linguistically to its larger and better known Araucanian sister language Mapudungun." Thus I would say that if Hulliche/Huilliche is not really a separate language frm Mapudungan under a macro-language including both, other dialects might qualify; but this is not an area I know much about. Has not the JAC been petitioned? Agreed; either the current code should be deprecated and a new code established, or if there is a reason to consider the separate dialects languages in some circumsta</pre> CE Whitehead 2013-01-02T00:29:37 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9771 <pre>Am I right in noticing that the use of discussed "gender speech subtag" actually relates to the text/speech construction? Until now I understood the IETF tags system as the meta-information system for the existing (already constructed) texts. -Yury </pre> Yury Tarasievich 2012-12-20T06:46:44 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9740 <pre>To rein in the discussion from things I think are off-topic and out of scope, particularly complexities across the world's languages in relation to grammatical gender, I'm sending draft requests to capture what I _do_ intend the scope of consideration to be. (These encompass the male/female/neutral gender distinctions. In my original male, I did also mention 'child' as potentially related in terms of speech UI resources; I'll leave that aside for now, though mention again here in case it's a factor in how the gender distinctions are considered.) This is not a formal proposal: I'm still looking for discussion on the idea generally to see if it's a useful thing to consider at all. Also, my statement on scope above is not intended to rule out separate discussion of other distinctions such as level of formality (e.g., tutoyer vs. vouvoyer). My thoughts on that are different than for gender, but it is a separate topic. ---------------------------- LANGUAGE SUBTAG REGISTRATION FORM 1. Name of requester: P</pre> Peter Constable 2012-12-19T22:42:03 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9687 <pre> We did reach some sort of resolution on this. Written content can be explicitly tagged with a script subtag, so "en-Latn" might be used not only to distinguish it in context from the unusual case of "English, written, but not in Latin," but also to emphasize that the content is written. Sign languages have their own subtags (e.g. 'psp'), and can alternatively be tagged using the extlang syntax ("sgn-psp") to emphasize visually that they are sign languages. I don't think we ever reached a consensus on tagging things like Signed Spoken English. Content that is neither written nor signed is usually assumed to be spoken, and for that purpose, the script subtag 'Zxxx' can be used, as it has the Description field "Code for unwritten documents" (not "Code for unwritten languages" as it did back in 2004). None of this is perhaps quite as intuitive as writing "en-written" or "en-signed" or "en-spoken", but it seems to work. -- Doug Ewell | Thornton, Colorado, USA http://www.ewellic.org | &lt; at &gt;DougEwell ­ _______</pre> Doug Ewell 2012-12-18T18:59:26 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9666 <pre>A lot of companies use pseudo-localization methods for testing localizability in which a source string in the development (e.g., in English) is transformed into a different spelling that uses other characters, changes the length and perhaps other things to provide something that can still be read in the same language by the development team / localization engineers but that emulates some of the qualities that might arise when the strings are truly localized. For example, “Bing App custom protocol” might be pseudo-localized to “[HoKVu]《ßíηģ Дþφ čũşťøm рґöŧõςοŀ伪》” or (for bidi testing) to “حفظ(Bing App custom protocol!)שמור”. Within MS, there’s been a bit of up and down history with how pseudo-loc content has been handled. When this was first done, all content got tagged using Windows numeric locale IDs (LCIDs), and there wasn’t one for pseudo, so the LCID for some language that Windows wasn’t localized into was used, which worked until the day came when Wi</pre> Peter Constable 2012-12-18T04:18:45 http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.ietf.languages/9665 <pre>I was thinking about this the other day dealing with the male/female voice variants for Nokia Maps. I don't recall that anyone has ever proposed variant subtags for male voice vs. female voice for use on speech assets. (I suppose child voice might be another relevant variant.) Does it seem appropriate to handle these voice distinctions via variant subtags on a language tag? Peter _______________________________________________ Ietf-languages mailing list Ietf-languages&lt; at &gt;alvestrand.no http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages </pre> Peter Constable 2012-12-18T03:48:06 Search the mailing list at Gmane query http://search.gmane.org/?group=$group=gmane.ietf.languages