gmane.org.operators.nanog

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Matthew Palmer — 2012-05-26T00:06:03

We pay what our providers think they can get away with.  Like most pricing
decisions, they're not based on any "technical logic", they're based on what
the market will bear.  Feel free to turn the process around -- decide what
the service is worth to you, tell the provider of the service that price,
and let them decide if they want to provide it to you at that price.  Don't
be too surprised if you get monkeys in exchange for your peanuts, though.

- Matt

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

Masataka Ohta — 2012-05-25T23:19:18


The point is that all the transport layer protocol have port
numbers.

So, if you have a stable IP address and, say, 256 stable port
numbers, your mobile device running applications as a server,
can be reached by the port number, distinguished from other
mobile devices sharing the IP address.

Such a service might cost $10 a month or Gree might offer
it free of charge.

Masataka Ohta

Re: Equinix Direct

Matthew Palmer — 2012-05-25T23:01:29

It depends on what you mean by "serious".  As I understand it, it's not
targeted at the big end of town -- there's no way you wouldn't be going
direct to the big tier 1s yourself if you needed multiple 10GE pipes, for a
wide variety of reasons.  Instead, it's intended as a "leg up" for the
smaller players to get into the marketplace *without* needing to make a huge
commitment to the big tier 1s and manage far more moving parts than would
otherwise be the case.

- Matt

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

2012-05-25T22:16:09

On Sat, 26 May 2012 06:44:58 +0900, Masataka Ohta said:

An IPv4 address can also be shared by many mobile terminals
distinguished by AOL userids.  How did that work out?

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Seth Mattinen — 2012-05-25T22:12:08

Is it really that hard to use a simple prefix list containing the one
prefix they're allowed to announce and default deny everything else?

~Seth

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Adam — 2012-05-25T22:08:28

Edward's response nailed this one on the head.  It has to do with the
additional support/hardware required to support a BGP session.  Granted,
once a BGP session is established it rarely requires any tweaking, but I've
spent hours troubleshooting a downed BGP session because the client's IPS
signature update decided TCP/179 was malicious.

You also have to implement additional filters to protect yourself from what
your client can advertise.  I'm lucky enough to work for a major ISP with
pretty sophisticated filters built off the public route registry, but not
all ISPs have this functionality.

Adam

On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 12:18 PM, Edward J. Dore <
edward.dore< at >freethought-internet.co.uk> wrote:

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

Masataka Ohta — 2012-05-25T21:44:58


For people of NANOG, certainly.

Or, there can be commercial home agent service providers,
which may not be identical to your mobile operator, which
is something like MVNO over the Internet.

For NAT penetration, mobile tunneling of IP over TCP/UDP is
necessary.

An IPv4 home address may be shared by many mobile
terminals distinguished by port numbers, which is
why IPv6 is not necessary.

Masataka Ohta

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

Arturo Servin — 2012-05-25T18:35:36

I wouldn't be so picky to have an static IP address in my phone, bur for sure I want a global IPvx one.


-as


On 25 May 2012, at 15:00, Christopher Morrow wrote:

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

Christopher Morrow — 2012-05-25T18:00:18


END-2-END!!!

Re: Current IPv6 state of US Mobile Phone Carriers

Joel jaeggli — 2012-05-25T17:50:52

the utlitiy of a static ip is probably lost on someone with only a
mobile phone...

Re: Database with telephone numbers

Seth Mattinen — 2012-05-25T16:38:29

I've found www.telcodata.us useful as well.

~Seth

RE: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

John van Oppen — 2012-05-25T16:21:42

I know we dislike BGP on small connections (even though we do it), it is an extra administrative hassle that tends to be the most work on the smallest connections.    Customers with multiple 10Gs tend to have small numbers of BGP related tickets than customers with a single fastE, given that, I can understand why soneone would want to charge, especially when it breaks the cookie-cutter templates that they are using for their low margin servers.    While something might be technically easy, don't forget that breaking automated proccesses does tend to cause administrative pain, that could be what the fees are for recouping. 



John

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Edward J. Dore — 2012-05-25T16:18:13

The only thing that I can really think of is that the BGP sessions do take up extra CPU time and memory on the routing engine, so there is an additional cost to the provider in terms of needing more routers and/or bigger routers if they have lots of customers speaking BGP to them that they may not have factored in to their standard pricing.

I guess there is also some extra cost in terms of NOC staff and systems to monitor the sessions as well as providing any troubleshooting etc. that they wouldn't have to do with "standard" customers that are statically routed.

Edward Dore 
Freethought Internet 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anurag Bhatia" <me< at >anuragbhatia.com>
To: "NANOG Mailing List" <nanog< at >nanog.org>
Sent: Friday, 25 May, 2012 5:01:11 PM
Subject: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Hello everyone

I have been aggressively looking for deals in servers in Europe for
anycasting. One thing which surprises me is the "setup costs" for BGP. Few
providers quoted additional $50

RE: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Michael Hallgren — 2012-05-25T16:14:52

Le vendredi 25 mai 2012 à 16:04 +0000, Ashish Rastogi a écrit :

Yes, hopefully not for simple BGP route exchange...! :)

mh

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Jared Mauch — 2012-05-25T16:13:33

There are starting to be a major difference in cost for supporting bgp. Taking a look at routing table size, many people are going to see troubles around 512k routes. Placing you on a device that doesn't need a full table or one at all will result in lower capital costs and lower operational costs as fewer features need to be toyed with.

Static routes work on nearly every device :-)

- Jared 

On May 25, 2012, at 12:01 PM, Anurag Bhatia <me< at >anuragbhatia.com> wrote:

RE: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Ashish Rastogi — 2012-05-25T16:04:08

Price is probably for high availability and high SLA standards.

Ashish Rastogi

________________________________________
From: Anurag Bhatia [me< at >anuragbhatia.com]
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2012 12:01 PM
To: NANOG Mailing List
Subject: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Hello everyone

I have been aggressively looking for deals in servers in Europe for
anycasting. One thing which surprises me is the "setup costs" for BGP. Few
providers quoted additional $50-100 which looks OK but a few of them quoted
as high as $150 *extra every month* just for having BGP (no full routing
table, but just default route pointing). Is there's any technical logic
behind such heavy costs? I mean at the end of day we are all talking at
layer 3 and thus it does not involves any hard connection/physical work.
What other members pay for BGP setup costs?

Thanks!

--

Anurag Bhatia
anuragbhatia.com
or simply - http://[2001:470:26:78f::5] if you are on IPv6 connected
network!

Linkedin <http://in.linkedin.com/

Re: Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

jim deleskie — 2012-05-25T16:04:08

IMHO the only reason(s) would be to discourage people from asking for
it, or as a $$ grab.

-jim

On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 1:01 PM, Anurag Bhatia <me< at >anuragbhatia.com> wrote:

Industry practice for BGP costs - one time or fixed/monthly?

Anurag Bhatia — 2012-05-25T16:01:11

Hello everyone


I have been aggressively looking for deals in servers in Europe for
anycasting. One thing which surprises me is the "setup costs" for BGP. Few
providers quoted additional $50-100 which looks OK but a few of them quoted
as high as $150 *extra every month* just for having BGP (no full routing
table, but just default route pointing). Is there's any technical logic
behind such heavy costs? I mean at the end of day we are all talking at
layer 3 and thus it does not involves any hard connection/physical work.
What other members pay for BGP setup costs?



Thanks!

FBI Presses for Amendment to CALEA to cover social networks

Jay Ashworth — 2012-05-25T15:57:06

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/fbi-forming-communications-assistance-center-to-help-spy-on-americans/2012/05/24/gJQAFuuSnU_story.html

Re: Database with telephone numbers

Jarek Kasjaniuk — 2012-05-25T15:54:16

W dniu 25.05.2012 17:02, Andy Smith pisze:

Thank you to all of you for help and fast response to my inquiry.

--
Jarek Kasjaniuk

PS. I know the site is in Polish...
but may be this link will be useful to someone.

http://www.uke.gov.pl/tablice/home.do?execution=e5s1

1. Stacjonarne publiczne sieci telefoniczne ->  Fixed public telephone network
2. Ruchome (komórkowe) publiczne sieci telefoniczne -> Mobile (cellular) public telephone networks

Re: Database with telephone numbers

Andy Smith — 2012-05-25T15:02:53

www.nanpa.com (North American Number Plan Association).  This is the
"official" site for area code/exchange information in North America.
www.localcallingguide.com also has information, but I'm not sure how
"official" it is.  Both sites have multiple ways of searching, i.e. per
area code, by lata, by company, etc.

On Fri, May 25, 2012 at 9:47 AM, Jarek Kasjaniuk
<jarek< at >dolsatbelchatow.pl>wrote: