gmane.linux.region.israel

Re: Memory manipulator

Tzafrir Cohen — 2008-08-30T08:05:45

I don't understand exactly what are the data you have and which are missing. On a first glance it seems that Cheat Engine relies on hand-crafted symbols tables provided by the user. So ptrace gives the required low-level abilities. If I understand things correctly: what you need is gdb with hand-crafted symbol tables, right?

Memory manipulator

Noam Rathaus — 2008-08-30T04:55:32

Hi, I have been using Cheat Engine (http://www.cheatengine.org/) to manipulate the memory of applications on Windows for quite some time - mainly useful for testing software for quirks and bugs. I was wondering whether someone knew of a equivalent program for Linux? I am mainly looking for memory value discovery and value changing abilities.

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Amos Shapira — 2008-08-27T22:58:04

2008/8/27 Shlomi Fish public.gmane.org>: With all the sympathy and sharing of your frustration, I also have to take into consideration that my employer expects me to take reasonable decisions for the company. It sounds like investing in cards which will not be just "plug and play" today and wasting my paid time on getting them to work is not a decision he'll look at favourably. Thanks, --Amos ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Re: Small victories, but more work to be done

Dotan Cohen — 2008-08-27T16:28:20

2008/8/27 Nadav Har'El math.technion.ac.il>: Because I personally have never been able to play embedded WMV in the browser on Linux, yet I've never had a problem playing embedded Flash. WMV as a standalone file plays fine in VLC and Mplayer, though. Additionally, I understand that Windows Firefox users have a hard time playing WMV content in Firefox, yet the Flash plugin must be easy to install. This is more a victory for Firefox than for Linux, but promoting Firefox at any website set precedent for other sites to be Firefox-friendly, or in other words, not require IE. At least they are admitting that not everyone can be forced to use IE. For playing standalone files, yes. Content embedded in the browser is another matter. Correct 100%. Please let me know which banks those are and I will write to them and call them. I encourage you to do the same.

Re: Small victories, but more work to be done

Jonathan Ben Avraham — 2008-08-27T13:26:14

Hi Velery, How about the video content on JPost.com? Did someone mention then already? - yba On Wed, 27 Aug 2008, Valery Reznic wrote:

Re: Small victories, but more work to be done

Nadav Har'El — 2008-08-27T12:38:49

On Wed, Aug 27, 2008, Dotan Cohen wrote about "Small victories, but more work to be done": Hi, I'm a bit curious - why do you consider changing from WMV to Flash important for Linux or Firefox users? Last time I checked, most Linux distributions could play neither WMV nor Flash movies out of the box, but software to do both is available for free. Software to play WMV is even available as free software (e.g., mplayer)? Or am I missing something? I think we have a much, much, bigger problem with sites (the most notorious are the banks) which instead of using ordinary links and (if they must) standard Javascript, use IE-specific tricks. You can't get around these problems by installing any additional software...

When to boycott hardware only partially supported by Linux? (Re:Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?)

Omer Zak — 2008-08-27T12:29:09

[... snipped ...] I use (relatively) low-end nVidia graphic cards, with the Free 'nv' driver (rather than their proprietary driver). According to the way Amos described his people's needs, the 'nv' driver is enough for their needs. What Amos is voting against with his employer's wallet (if he follows through this plan) is against high-end graphic cards and those features, which require proprietary drivers. For the (relatively) low-end graphic market, nVidia is effectively Free. Amos' people's display needs are properly supported under Linux using only Free drivers (assuming that my recommendation passes his evaluation). It is an interesting philosophical discussion (which properly belongs to another Linux-IL thread) whether buying a product with features A+B, for use which needs only feature A, and such that feature B is supported only by proprietary software - is a violation of boycott against hardware which is not supported by Free Software. By the way, I still remember the days in which ATI were anti Free Software, and I even signed a petition about this issue. --- Omer

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Shlomi Fish — 2008-08-27T12:07:35

Great, just great. So while considering all the apathy hang-vidia shows towards open-source, their crappy BLOBs, and they dropping support from older cards, and not releasing specs, etc. - you're still supporting them with your wallet. How do you expect hardware vendors to ever play nicely with open-source operating systems, if even Linux users still buy their products despite their general apathy towards us? So, the real problem is with people like you, who are too pragmatist on their free software ideals, and still support companies like nVidia. I personally am not going to buy a product that's not properly supported under Linux, just so I can be sure I'm not supporting such abusive companies with my wallet. Regards, Shlomi Fish ----------------------------------------------------------------- Shlomi Fish http://www.shlomifish.org/ The Case for File Swapping - http://xrl.us/bjn7i Shlomi, so what are you working on? Working on a new wiki about unit testing fortunes in freecell? -- Ran Eilam ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Re: Small victories, but more work to be done

Omer Zak — 2008-08-27T10:59:36

Hello Dotan, Recently, there was a long thread about this subject in the w3c-9EcH6oogKltmZG3l6A/jRsQXj+O6+u1k< at >public.gmane.org mailing list. The problematic pages is the HOT broadcasts schedule page and the page for contacting them: http://www.hot.net.il/EPG/Templates/EPGTimeline/EPGTimeline.aspx http://www.hot.net.il/HOT.aspx?FolderID=2120〈=he --- Omer On Wed, 2008-08-27 at 03:45 -0700, Valery Reznic wrote: ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Re: Small victories, but more work to be done

Valery Reznic — 2008-08-27T10:45:09

Hi, Dotan. Ben Gurion Airport site not work in the FF (at least on Linux) http://www.iaa.gov.il/Rashat/Templates/InsidePages/OnlineFlightsTemplate.aspx?NRMODE=Published&NRORIGINALURL=%2fRashat%2fen-US%2fAirports%2fBenGurion%2finformationForTravelers%2fOnlineFlights%2easpx%3fflightsType%3ddep&NRNODEGUID=%7bB2D883F7-7E57-48F9-A6AF-001AD3758E05%7d&NRCACHEHINT=Guest&Advanced=1 I can select nothing here: Comapny, Contry, City Airport. Valery --- On Wed, 8/27/08, Dotan Cohen public.gmane.org> wrote: ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Small victories, but more work to be done

Dotan Cohen — 2008-08-27T10:12:56

Today I got a letter from YNET that they are moving their videos to Flash from WMV to support Firefox and Linux users. Nice move, and they will have me visiting their website, and their advertisers, as "soon" as the change happens. I have spoken with technical support at postil twice by telephone, and they are aware of the problems of using the bank.postil.com website with Firefox and are promising a new website "soon". Both Leumit and Macabi have promised me new Firefox-compatible websites "soon". All these companies now show that they are aware that Firefox exists, they are aware that people are using it, and they are aware that their websites do not work with Firefox. They all promise to support Firefox "soon". "Soon" is not enough anymore, however, as we've been hearing that for at least a year now. Please, please, write a letter or pick up the phone and contact these companies to let them know that we, their paying customers, need their services to work in a standards-compatible way. Now is the time to pressure them, because they acknowledge that we exist. Ynet: http://www.ynet.co.il/home/0,7340,L-824,00.html service< at >y-i.co.il help< at >y-i.co.il ynet, רח' יגאל אלון 127, תל אביב, 67443 Postil: http://www.israelpost.co.il/postquestion.nsf/questionform?Openform 1-599-500-171 Leumit: 1-700-507-507 1-800-396-333 02-572-2442 Maccabi: http://www.maccabi-health.co.il/site/HE/macabi.asp?pi=32 1-700-50-53-53 03-5143501 If you know of other Israeli websites that do not work in Firefox or Linux, please mention them and I will contact them. Thanks!

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Amos Shapira — 2008-08-27T07:44:32

2008/8/26 Omer Zak public.gmane.org>: Not TODAY, YESTERDAY. These monitors are sitting unused for almost a week now. Thanks for the specific model number. Will look into it. You pretty much nailed it, just like in the other mailing list I asked this question on - nVidia it is, with all the sympathy for ATI's FOSS support. I can only hope right now that next year I'll get to install Ubunutu/CentOS/Debian/Mandrake/whatever instead of the crappy Windows XP/Vista almost everyone here (except about three of us) have on their desktop. "My people" don't do graphics work, as I said - they do mostly server-side C++ and perl programming. Thanks everyone for your opinions, you've been very helpful. Cheers, --Amos ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Oron Peled — 2008-08-25T23:28:17

Omer, you somehow miss my point. I'm not talking about some abstract future covered with nice ATI promises. This is *working* FOSS code written outside of ATI: http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=xorg/driver/xf86-video-ati.git Please note who host the source, and the names of the commiters (I found only one working for ATI). Your skepticism would have been valid a year ago when ATI promised to improve the FOSS drivers and docs -- at that time it was only words. However, they actually shipped the docs and are actually helping the developers, so we *already* have functional code. The only "futuristic" part about this is the normal time to test, debug, issue pre-releases (as you can see there were several), have distros package and release etc. This is the normal process done daily by any other FOSS project and any distro. Your argument is equivalent to saying: "How can you bank on Java if something would happen to Sun and they won't ship your free software Java implementation?" ... Ah, but Sun already released Java as GPLv3. The missing parts have already been completed. It only takes some time for distros to package and ship this work (BTW: some distros like my (anonymous) distro already did it). I'll stop chewing this thread as it must have bored all other subscribers by now.

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Omer Zak — 2008-08-25T22:00:56

Amos presumably needs a working solution TODAY. Promises for bright future are irrelevant. If he chooses ATI cards, he should use only 1st reason to justify his choice. This reason may well be enough to make the justification. Plans of mice and men always change. ATI might fold 8 months from now, or be taken over by nVidia and have its product lines discontinued, or switch to solar powered 3D holographic displays. If they are cheap enough, then the following plan would make economic sense: 1. Buy today the cheap nVidia cards (such as GeForce FX 5200, which I chose because of its low price). 2. A year from now, ATI releases its gee whiz drivers. Buy top of line ATI cards to work with those drivers. Their price will be lower than the price you'd pay if you bought today the ATI cards. 3. Remove the cheap nVidia cards and have them recycled, or donate them to one of the Linux based school computer labs. The difference in price of the ATI cards will cover the cost of the nVidia cards. Caveat: the above would work unless Amos's people need to develop custom graphic software which works only with one type of graphic cards. --- Omer

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Oron Peled — 2008-08-25T21:16:29

Bzzt. You oversimplify: * Scenario I: - Let's assume Amos buys today an old ATI (r300/r400 based) because he cannot wait. - He gets reasonable 3D today (One of my Pentiums began doing compiz a year ago, after a regular update [ATI 9100IGP]). - Items {2,3} *still* apply, because some of the future updates would improve even those old cards. For example, some of the updates Airlie work on, involve adding kernel modesetting support for the old r300/r400 as well. (this would help in monitor hotplugging, xrandr, etc.) * Scenario II: - Amos buys today an ATI r500/r600 cards. - Can use FOSS drivers today (no 3D acceleration etc.) - Or can use proprietary drivers today. - But because of items {2,3} he would get an *improved* FOSS drivers within the next year (cleanup, release engineering, distribution roll out). So with ATI we have an "installment plan" ("Tashlumim") in two steps: * Get working (but limited) solution today (either old cards or proprietary drivers or no 3D acceleration) * Get better support for the *same* hardware on the next upgrade of your distro. Where's the second step for nVidia cards? Bye,

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Hetz Ben Hamo — 2008-08-25T20:25:52

Hi, Regarding your 3rd reason: Go pick Geforce 6XXX, 7XXX, 8XXX, 9XXX based card from ANY vendor, and you'll see on nvidia's web site that it's the SAME driver (NVIDIA-Linux-x86-173.14.12 as I write this email), which means any fixes to the driver will be working across the board, and not only that, but new features to the drivers will be working on your OLD card, and the best thing - it works on any modern distribution, be it RHEL-4, Ubuntu, Debian, SuSE, slackware, Mandriva, Gentoo, you-name-it! a simple installer, simple text GUI, does everything for you, all you have to do is restart your X. I can give you an example: In the last year, nVidia added PurePlay HD support to the Linux drivers. Neither Xine nor mplayer supports it, but from my experiece with XP on a low-end Dual core machine with some cheap 8XXX based card, playing blu-ray movies (well, rip off from the media..) with this PureVideo HD plays the video very well on XP while taking only 25% CPU load, and if you have a 7XXX or 8XXX or 9XXX based card, it will work for you as well (well, sort of.. until the guys at Xine or MPlayer or VLC will decide to add the support, its documented and the libraries are installed by default when installing the driver). Want to have some fun? Go take a Radeon 9xxx and try to use their propietary drivers (which has some advantages compared to the standard Xorg drivers) on Fedora 9, Ubunty Hardy or the latest OpenSuSE, good luck with that! how's you kernel hacking skill btw? cause you'll need them since the driver is different from whats available on Radeon 1XXX, 2XXX, 3XXX, 4XXX based cards. Actually, VIA drivers on Xorg are pretty good (well, besides the dual head which you can find tons of complains about it on the net), and they also announced that they'll open source their drivers + specs. SiS = CRAP. period. Hetz

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Omer Zak — 2008-08-25T18:39:18

[... snipped ...] Sorry, but the 2nd and 3rd reasons to choose ATI exist in the future rather than today. If Amos Shapira can wait a year, then let him buy ATI a year from now. But if he needs a solution today, then several of the above promises are not relevant for him. --- Omer

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Oron Peled — 2008-08-25T16:56:19

* Intel would be best: 1. Full OSS drivers on any recent distro. 2. Good integration with the rest of x.org [xrandr etc.]) But.... They don't sell cards, only on-board chipsets. * My second choice today would be ATI cards: 1. As someone else mentioned older (e.g: r300) chipsets have pretty good support in the FOSS driver (including simple 3D, compiz etc.) 2. AMD/ATI released hardware specs last year and started cooperating with FOSS community, which is significant for the newer cards (http://www.x.org/docs/AMD) 3. Because of (2.), there is better support for modern cards on the pipe. Specifically, David Airlie (one of X.org developers from Red Hat) already announced not long ago about major improvements in r500/r600 chipsets. This is bleeding edge source in his git repository, but it is reasonable to expect this code to land within 6-12 months in fast paced distros (Debian testing, Fedora, etc.) * nVidia have: 1. The best proprietary Linux support ;-) 2. The worst FOSS support. 3. Someone else on this thread already detailed some of the problems it brings (updates, cards with quick End-Of-Life, etc.) * The only worse alternatives than nVidia are all the VIA, SIS and their unloved, binary, non-supported, blobs. Bye,

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Chaim Keren-Tzion — 2008-08-25T10:10:33

Hi, Answers.com / wiki.answers.com a top-200 LAMP & Java site is looking for a top notch Linux Sysadmin. The work is with LAMP, Bash Perl, Jboss etc. The preferred candidate will have a strong scripting background. The work is in Yerushlayim in Malcha, across from the mall. It's a great place to work. You can read all about it here: http://www.answers.com/main/jobs.jsp Send your CV to the email on the site. Chaim Keren Tzion

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Gilboa Davara — 2008-08-25T05:49:27

While I'm using nVidia (on a large number of machines) I'm thinking about switching to AMD/ATI. A couple of reasons. A. Having an OSS driver is big plus. While it may or may not use the OSS driver, having the -option- to use an OSS drivers when the binary driver fails and/or you're trying to use unsupported software/OS combo * should be taken into account. If you use nVidia, you're limited to what-ever OS/arch/etc nVidia chose for you. B. The current driver family (16x.xx and 17x.xx) has miserable 2D performance. In nVidia's defense, they are working hard to solve these problems, but as it stands, my 11 y/o PII233/MAC64 laptop, with it's patched DRI driver, literally run circles around my 2xE5335/GF9800GTX workstation in 2D. C. nVidia is a -very- annoying tendency to kill the support for older cards unexpectedly - switching to very problematic legacy drivers. And as you're limited to binary drivers, once nVidia drops to the support for your card, you're screwed. As it stand, if you only require 2D with limited 3D (Read: compiz and friends) an older ATI card (r300/r400-based **) should suite you best. Make sure you do some digging (< at >google) on the target card before buying it. - Gilboa * Xen under both Linux and Solaris, FreeBSD/AMD64, PPC/PPC64/SPARC/etc. ** 9800*, X300/600/800. ================================================================= To unsubscribe, send mail to linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org with the word "unsubscribe" in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail linux-il-request-NSemkxREmS1YZAO8hgG6+w< at >public.gmane.org

Re: Preferred video card for Linux dual-head?

Moshe Gorohovsky — 2008-08-25T05:14:25

Hi, I had bought ATI Sapphire HD 2400 PRO for a developer workstation. The card was in mass sales two months ago. The card is working perfect with Debian lenny - July 2008 and with Knoppix 5.3.1. Graphics display and video processing seems fine with xserver-xorg-video-radeonhd video driver. - Moshe. Amos Shapira wrote: