gmane.culture.transportation.humanpowered.boats

Re: World Record - Saltwater v Freshwater

Rick Willoughby — 2008-09-30T08:56:04

Ian The differences would relate to density and temperature. The higher density of saltwater means the boat floats higher so less wetted surface but the friction coefficient increases slightly. These factors effectively offset each other for the V11 hull. Temperature is a bigger factor and is likely to make a difference. The viscosity varies significantly with the temperature of the water. In warm ocean water you could expect somewhere between 1 and 2% extra distance over a high mountain lake like Whitefish. I do not know the lake temperature but I expect it to be no more than about 5 to 10C even at this time of year. There was still snow on the surroundings hills in May and the temperatures are already cold overnight. I notice water temperature change at Lysterfield. It is a bit easier toward the end of summer. Rick Willoughby

Re: Fwd: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl2008!

Neal Smith — 2008-09-28T00:00:53

Maryland --- On Fri, 9/26/08, Roger Linke public.gmane.org> wrote: From: Roger Linke public.gmane.org> Subject: Re: [hpv-boats] Fwd: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl 2008! To: "Human Powered Vehicles -- Boats" public.gmane.org> Date: Friday, September 26, 2008, 12:52 PM For the newbies, what state is that in? rl -- This message comes to you via the hpv-boats-Wizm5X4GRk5g9hUCZPvPmw< at >public.gmane.org mailing list, sponsored by http://ihpva.org/ Visit http://bikelist.org/mailman/listinfo/hpv-boats to manage your subscription.

World Record

Ian Cassell — 2008-09-27T10:21:15

Just back from holidays and seen the news. Congratulations Greg on your world record, it was only a matter of time before pedal boats outdid paddle boats. Also congratulations Rick for designing the boat, it all came together on the day. A question for you Rick, if the attempt was made on sea water and not fresh water how much further would Greg have gone? Ian Cassell

Re: Fwd: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl2008!

Roger Linke — 2008-09-26T16:52:45

For the newbies, what state is that in? rl

Fwd: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl 2008!

2008-09-26T14:33:30

____________________________________ From: JFreeEnt To: FreeEntTec Sent: 9/25/2008 12:44:02 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time Subj: Fwd: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl 2008! ____________________________________ Looking for simple solutions to your real-life financial challenges? _Check out WalletPop for the latest news and information, tips and calculators_ (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100000075x1209382257x1200540686/aol?redir=http://www .walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001) . ----------------- Forwarded Message: Subj: better late than never - Rockford Hydrobowl 2008! Date: 9/24/2008 11:29:54 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time From: _BikeguyBob_ (mailto:BikeguyBob) To: _BikeguyBob_ (mailto:BikeguyBob) Once again, it almost time for the annual water event / spectacle known as Rockford Hydrobowl, (a little later than normal) this Saturday, September 27, 2008. Like always, it will be at Rock Cut State Park, in the Red Oak picnic area. I took the liberty of reservi

Re: Inflatable Vic + Flight Stuff

2008-09-22T18:34:41

In a message dated 9/22/2008 2:25:20 AM Eastern Daylight Time, vgarza-p5z8rGbaJqNVdeU8dOWy+g< at >public.gmane.org writes: Wonder if your weedless props sacrifice much efficiency, guess it's time to check your web page... They sacrifice 1 mph at 6 or so. 'nother words, they will go 5 at same power as 6 for a straight standard blade. This was for the proa. I caven't tested them on the monohull ("pentamaran"). I had drain caps in the front and I would have propped it up to drain, but still don't remember any water. I probably ran her with a three blade, but also had a two. I think I remembrer talking to you with the electric pontoon. Long time ago.... I had triangle shapped hulls which Did take on water but I'm 90 % sure I brought the curved-sectioned cat hulls as used in Hydrobowl 95. Note that the skeg is fixed on the cat so that it sets propped up anyway. When was waldonwoods "98? "00? Cheers, Jake **************Looking for simple solutions to your real-life financial challenges? Chec

RE: Inflatable Vic + Flight Stuff

GARZA, VICTOR — 2008-09-22T06:24:51

Jake, I thought that was you, but obviously not. The leaking boat was unpainted and set up at a tilt after the races, if I remember correctly. I remember thinking that the leaking boat would have been slower with water inside. Also, I believe this same boat used a 3 bladed prop which I thought would be slower than a 2 blade. Yet, all the boats looked fast in the unweedy part of the races, I was taping earlier. The surprise speed to me was young kid on what I believe was then called a surf ski, looked like a surf board with a prop drive underneath. But maybe he just avoided weeds by luck of the draw.... Yea, the pontoon had to be me. At one point, I was trying to get pictures from the other side shooting in toward the crowds milling and testing various boats near the event shore. There was another guy out there in a small single hull paddling around and fishing at one point as well. Wonder if your weedless props sacrifice much efficiency, guess it's time to check your web page... Vic _______________

Re: Inflatable Vic + Flight Stuff

2008-09-21T14:52:40

Vic, That must have *not* been me, cause my hulls were bone dry. There *still* good and no holes. The problem I had was the weeds. Ron had truncated the course, cut off a corner because of them. I still got toasted because I couldn't reach my prop to clean it. I remembrer John Howard dramatically stopping during the Crit to clean his out. The only thing I could do is jam her into reverse and shake *some* of them off. Now, I got weedlaess props and kick-up drives You had the electric pontoon? I vaguely remember. jake **************Looking for simple solutions to your real-life financial challenges? Check out WalletPop for the latest news and information, tips and calculators. (http://www.walletpop.com/?NCID=emlcntuswall00000001)

RE: Inflatable Vic + Flight Stuff

GARZA, VICTOR — 2008-09-19T21:55:12

>the thing shippers and flights like to do now is charge for *volume* as wella s weight. I DO have developments for more compact but the cost is pretty u p there< Southwest used to ship "surfboards" free a few years ago in their checked luggage. So if your hulls are tough enough you might be able to call them that. Don't know the length limit, but they now charge $50 each way for surfboards. form the airport that day...Long day for me, but there were a LOT of different boat people there.< Not profish. Ron pressed Mike and myself as picture takers for the event, so that's mostly what I did. I remember you had a leak in one of you hulls. You punched a hole to drain out the inside and the water just flowed out like a small fountain. Think I got a picture of it. I found out most of the lake was weeds when I explored in my pontoon- except for the racing area. scrapyard for some stainless steel "spars" that you could buy, use, then sell ba ck??< Thanks. Lowes or Home Depot always take back the pipes

Inflatable Vic + Flight Stuff

2008-09-19T17:48:55

In a message dated 9/19/2008 12:20:49 AM Eastern Daylight Time, vgarza-p5z8rGbaJqNVdeU8dOWy+g< at >public.gmane.org writes: Interesting to hear you've traveled with your 'foils' by air. Not going to Rockford, my air travel versions aren't designed for hpb competition. Though one of these made it by air to the Michigan hydrofest with me many years ago, did not compete. Maybe will make a kinetic sculpture event sometime in the future. One of my travel designs uses precut lengths of 36" and 48" X 1/2" plumbers pipe which is purchased at destination and slides into fittings to make the rigid frame part. This gets around the travel weight and volume limitations Vic, I *shipped* them by air pre 9-11. The cost both nationally and internationally would make our readers dizzy? How about 60.00 US anywhere in the country, and I walked in and dropped tham off right at the United terminal! And 120 overseas...Now, that wouldn't even pay a TSA union guy for an hour. the thing shippers and flights like to do

Packable boats - Inflatables and the like

Alex RIchards — 2008-09-19T09:35:35

It's possibly old news to some, but a while ago I stumbled across this site http://www.yostwerks.com/MainMenu.html with loads of details about folding kayaks including a semi-inflatable version. It might be of interest to some, the big question would be how to get the drive out of the boat, but I'm sure Rick could come up with something ingenious. Minght be slightly easier to make than a fully inflatable. Alex

RE: some skinny on inflatables

GARZA, VICTOR — 2008-09-19T04:19:52

Hey, Jake. Maybe if some of us make breakthroughs on an inflatable travel version of a racing boat it would increase participation in hpb events like Rockford. ;-) Discount carrier Southwest airlines still allows 2 checked bags of 100 lbs total plus carryons at no charge, but they have to be pretty compact- 62" total. Interesting to hear you've traveled with your 'foils' by air. Not going to Rockford, my air travel versions aren't designed for hpb competition. Though one of these made it by air to the Michigan hydrofest with me many years ago, did not compete. Maybe will make a kinetic sculpture event sometime in the future. One of my travel designs uses precut lengths of 36" and 48" X 1/2" plumbers pipe which is purchased at destination and slides into fittings to make the rigid frame part. This gets around the travel weight and volume limitations but results in a heavier boat when assembled.... Vic Is anyone reading this going to Rockford?? jake **************Psssst...Have you heard the

Re: inflatable

Alex RIchards — 2008-09-18T16:39:11

I've been experimenting with the PVC pond-liner you can buy at garden centres. It seems to work great for the inflatable tube I've made so far and they also have all the glue to "weld" it up. It does only come in black though, but it is available and not expensive. Alex

inflatable ii (try again)

2008-09-18T16:24:31

Sweet. And they make a 10mph boat: "GlasSkipper - The pedal boat for large waters "If you have the need for speed and love the water, the GlasSkipper is * snip/ on and on*** Dan, List, no, I think what you're referring to is their fiberglasds version. Waht I'm talking of is the short rubber thingy that pulls a fairly good size wake behind it. If you have the need for speed, obviously the hulls need to be longer and thinner and those spars are all the more important as lenghth increases. The diminishing return is as the hulls get potentially faster the spars get more bulky. My hydrofoil hulls were in the neighborhood of 12 feet long. speed was irrelevant as they were out of the water by the time they had appreciable speed and / or drag. My takeoff speed was /is 6 to 7 MPH. I dunno how long I would be able to hold that speed in displacement, and furshure, the was a hydrofoil assist factor taking place in that range. In other words, part of the hulls were out of the water and less surface area

Fwd: inflatable

2008-09-18T16:06:00

**************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com. (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)

some skinny on inflatables

2008-09-18T15:43:39

Hey everybody, For those who consider running their own hulls, some of the stuff that I can chatter about is that there are three main medias. They include neoprene, PVC and Hypolon. There are others, but those are the main ones. We make ours out of Hypolon. Most of the hulls inflatable of the past have included a pair of stiffening poles or stringers going along the length that affix to the aikos. It's not unusual for hulls to be as light as.say six pounds per side. I've seen lighter, but they might tend to be fragile. The three medias mentioned here are under pressure, and I forgot to mention about a really old one and one who supplied HP movement (Flying Fish). They are "Stewkie" out of UK, and they involved a coated Cordura type of material (coated with Hypolon??) with an inflatable bladder inside. The bladder is like a kids inflatable plastic toy Is anyone reading this going to Rockford?? jake **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blo

inflatable

2008-09-18T15:20:10

Hey everybody, Noticed some dialog on portable boats lately I have been running custom inflatable hulls out of here for over a dozen years now. The ability of stuffing a hydrofoil on a plane is a total gas!! one of the other places that has been around for awhile is Prophish, whom I first encountered at Waldonwoods in , I wanrt to say, 98? It is on Ron Drynan's site run by Mike Lampi. Both those guys and yours truely were at that event BTW. I called it "Waldonweeds because the racers got hung up, especially my boat. Prophishes seem a little pricey, OTOH, that would seem to be what it would take to recoup a return on your invesatment..... Cheers, jake **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com. (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)

RE: Re: hpv-boats Digest, Vol 50, Issue 5

GARZA, VICTOR — 2008-09-17T22:35:15

Hi Larry. I haven't ridden one of these paddlewheel type in over 30 years and didn't think them very efficient back at that time. I didn't see where the pictured unit is made. But I've had bad experience with some of the inflatable pontoons coming out of Asia, years back. One used a troll motor prop and an open, unlubed nylon bevel gear system and very low quality low pressure pontoons and was not any faster than the paddlewheelers. But at least the price was very low :-) One question is why these paddlewheeler types have persisted for so many decades and still outsell any other leg powered boat by such a huge factor! Vic I don't remember the exact figure, but am fairly certain that our best speed over the short run was less than 3 mph. So, in my opinion, nearly anything would be "more efficient" than those things. ;-) Best wishes, Larry -- This message comes to you via the hpv-boats-Wizm5X4GRk5g9hUCZPvPmw< at >public.gmane.org mailing list, sponsored by http://ihpva.org/ Visit h

RE: Re: hpv-boats Digest, Vol 50, Issue 5

Larry Smith — 2008-09-17T18:13:43

Hi Vic, I don't know if you have tried one of the paddle-craft you describe, but here is my experience: At Green Lake in Seattle, there are such "boats" for rent. Some years ago, out of curiosity, a friend and I rented one, ...marked a measured distance on a dock,and made some killing-effort runs, which we timed with a stop-watch. I don't remember the exact figure, but am fairly certain that our best speed over the short run was less than 3 mph. So, in my opinion, nearly anything would be "more efficient" than those things. ;-) Best wishes, Larry

RE: Re: hpv-boats Digest, Vol 50, Issue 5

GARZA, VICTOR — 2008-09-17T15:56:25

Thanks for the info on your boat. I like the low weight, pedal drive and that it holds 2 people. Some questions: Can it be packed down small enough for airline check luggage? There would be an overweight surcharge and possibly over volume surcharge in the US. This is in addition to regular baggage surcharges. Can used in slightly rough water (0.4 meter waves), seems like a high center of gravity design? Can the twisted chain drive take the stress and weeds be easily removed from the prop? What is the draft with one or two people and is there a provision for the propeller to swing away undamaged? How long does it take to assemble out of the storage box by someone with practice, since no tools are required? What is guess for the top speed that can be maintained for 30 minutes or so with one non athletic rider of maybe 120 watt output? Are there other, low resistance pontoon shapes available? Is it more efficient than the high selling ,very popular 2 person hard plastic paddle wheel design that can be

Re: Amphibious d-cycle

Bob Stuart — 2008-09-17T13:18:41

On 17-Sep-08, at 1:22 AM, Alex RIchards wrote: Perhaps the Dutch don't have hills, or other reasons to brake suddenly. If they have sand on their shorelines, I wonder what it does to the hubless machinery. The necessary seals would create a lot of drag. Best, Bob Stuart The more I try to get all my mail answered, the more shows up.